In this episode of Strong Conversations, we continue the AI conversation as host Sam Marcoux sits down with Bob Baldocchi and Paul Cardis of ON3 to explore how AI is transforming training, knowledge sharing, and jobsite performance in the construction industry. ON3's frontline AI platform helps builders, contractors, and field teams access trusted company-approved information instantly, reducing rework, improving productivity, and ensuring critical knowledge is available when and where it's needed. The conversation explores the future of AI in construction, the importance of a single source of truth, and how technology can help close the gap between training and execution.
In this episode:
00;00;00;10 - 00;00;16;14
Sam
And welcome back to Strong Conversations Real Stories with the leaders, innovators and changemakers in the building industry. I'm Sam Mark, who is always and I am joined. I've got I've got a whole team. I got a contingent here. You guys are filling out the couch here. Welcome, Bob. Paul from on three. Welcome to the.
00;00;16;14 - 00;00;17;21
Bob Baldocchi
Show. Thank you very much.
00;00;17;24 - 00;00;18;16
Paul Cardis
Great to be. Great to be here.
00;00;18;18 - 00;00;25;02
Sam
So as my, executive director would say, which one of you is more important? So, tell everybody what you guys do for all three.
00;00;25;06 - 00;00;27;04
Bob Baldocchi
Yeah, well, go ahead.
00;00;27;09 - 00;00;27;26
Paul Cardis
Go ahead.
00;00;27;27 - 00;00;48;36
Bob Baldocchi
Start. Well, Bob, I'm the CEO but head of business development here with on three. And we, we're basically, you know, an organization that's trying to get, you know, the information out to the front line construction teams. But, my job is to basically build relationships with, you know, our, our partners and builders and suppliers and, and try to figure out a way to get them to understand the benefits of what we're providing.
00;00;48;43 - 00;00;49;56
Sam
Excellent. Paul.
00;00;50;01 - 00;01;02;50
Paul Cardis
Well, I'm the leader of team on three here, and, CEO and co-founder. My job is to make sure we have the right culture, and we're going in the right direction with our strategy and our teams to to achieve success. So.
00;01;02;54 - 00;01;08;01
Sam
So for the uninitiated, Paul, if you could answer what is on three, if you had to do the elevator pitch for everybody.
00;01;08;05 - 00;01;31;24
Paul Cardis
Well, on three basically is the front line I platform to support construction workers and any real field worker out there, anybody who's working on their feet, we're working out of a truck. We want to be there. I companion like ChatGPT might be your companion, right? Writing a letter or doing, doing some work, on three will be that for construction and other frontline services specifically.
00;01;31;24 - 00;01;37;58
Sam
Like if you're on a job site and you need to know how to do something, is that is that where it would help in some cases? Okay.
00;01;38;00 - 00;01;58;36
Paul Cardis
Yeah, we envisioned this actually back in 2020. Okay. Before ChatGPT was really out in the wild yet, we were envisioning how I would really be important in the construction industry because everything's still analog. Right? So that's what we've been working on. And, we're excited to be where we're at today, working with a number of major homebuilders and suppliers like Simpson.
00;01;58;41 - 00;02;00;04
Paul Cardis
So it's really starting to take off.
00;02;00;16 - 00;02;13;18
Sam
So you guys envision this a number of years ago now what what brought you to that point where, hey, the industry needs this. Like you said, everything is still analog, but why? Why was now the right time for you guys to do this?
00;02;13;22 - 00;02;36;32
Bob Baldocchi
Well, I think the, the, the reality of it is, is that most people have their documentation, their information sitting in PowerPoints or sitting in their intranets or sitting, in binders somewhere. And if you're an office worker, it's great. You can access a lot of that information. But if you're somebody who works out in the field, as Paul said, that information becomes very difficult to you to access.
00;02;36;32 - 00;02;53;18
Bob Baldocchi
And so a lot of it's not even accessible mobile on a mobile device. So what we envisioned was let's bring those digital assets and let's bring those assets and digitize them and bring them out to a mobile device so that they can access them anytime, anywhere, and get the answers the way the company wants them to get the answers.
00;02;53;23 - 00;03;14;44
Bob Baldocchi
Because right now, what's happening is field level workers are going to go to YouTube, right? Go to ChatGPT. They're going to get in there and possibly get answers that aren't necessarily in line with the information that the company wants them to understand and know. And so mistakes start happening. So what we do is we digitize the single source of truth, so to speak, and we actually allow them to access that in the manner and the company wants them to have it.
00;03;14;49 - 00;03;34;33
Sam
So you're getting the information or if you're in the field and you do a search for this on the platform, you're getting the information. Let's just use Simpson Strong. Okay? I need to know how to install, you know, this product over here and they go to search for it. It's going to pull all the information from Simpson. Strong tie in that in that.
00;03;34;34 - 00;04;00;07
Bob Baldocchi
Exactly. So I'll give you an example. So we we use the example of how deep should I install a one inch anchor bolt. Right. Well you have a 388 page catalog. And it's in there. It's it's on page 346. So our answer will come back consolidated through the I. It'll give you the answer but then it'll actually draw you to page 344 of that catalog page and allow you to kind of see the information in the reference document where that information came from.
00;04;00;12 - 00;04;07;20
Bob Baldocchi
And then that information is actually shareable to the trades in the subs or you can show an inspector to say we're actually doing it the correct way. Yeah.
00;04;07;25 - 00;04;28;26
Sam
So I love that because, one of the things that was fascinating to me, and this is I think it's still true today, but, you know, Google is the number one search engine in the world. And then the second one is YouTube. Do you guys just point? I use that to if I need to figure out how to change the, you know, the hose in my kitchen sink or something like that, I go to YouTube and say, this is how you're going to do it.
00;04;28;31 - 00;04;47;02
Sam
And I feel like I'm not alone in that. Everyone is clearly doing that all over the all over the planet, all over the world. But you don't necessarily getting the manufacturer's recommendations. You're not necessarily you don't know necessarily if you're getting the right information or if you're doing it the right way. You're sort of just blindly trusting that the first thing you see in most cases is going to be right.
00;04;47;02 - 00;04;49;21
Sam
And that's not always the case.
00;04;49;26 - 00;05;05;14
Paul Cardis
All that. Yeah, it's a big, big problem, right? In fact, because codes vary by locale. You know, we've got all the addendums. There's different applications of those those materials. So yeah it's critical that builders get the right information for the right job.
00;05;05;25 - 00;05;22;25
Sam
Yeah I think we had a conversation a couple of weeks ago before recording this, and I used the example of my daughter who had to do a, like a map, for a school project. And she went on Google and she, it was a timeline of like the Civil War or something like that, a revolutionary. It was a Revolutionary War.
00;05;22;30 - 00;05;46;45
Sam
And she went through and diligently put all these timelines together. But the one thing she didn't do was cite her sources. So when I reviewing her work, I looked at this and said, okay, so where did you get all this information? And she said, Google. So I'm like, all right, well, show me the website where Google told me I didn't go to a website, I it was she basically what she did is Google changed a search engine.
00;05;46;56 - 00;06;04;18
Sam
She took the I summary of each thing that she'd typed into her, her computer and it just said, okay, here you go. So she had no sources. And I'm like, we don't know if this is actually true or not. There's competing dates that she had on her timeline. It was just this AI that grabbed everything and put it together, and here you go.
00;06;04;23 - 00;06;25;54
Sam
So ultimately, she had to spend even more time basically deconstructing her project and then putting it back together, doing it the right way. And I think of that example, and I'm talking about what you guys are doing, is how critical is it to get it right the first time if you are going to, if you need training, if you need to search, because otherwise it's going to cost a builder and a team a small fortune every single time.
00;06;25;54 - 00;06;30;15
Sam
If they didn't do it right, right. If they if they, you know, rolled graphs, well.
00;06;30;15 - 00;06;49;04
Bob Baldocchi
That's exactly right. That there's 3 to 5% of every home build is, is there's rework costs. And so when you actually start calculating that number, it's tens of thousands of dollars per home that are spent doing rework. So things that already been done, they go back into the house and they have to redo them because they weren't done correctly.
00;06;49;09 - 00;07;09;09
Bob Baldocchi
So when you have that number out there in the industry, and then you have a tool like ours that can actually provide the power of the information to the front line teams to actually know that it's being done correctly the first time. And if it's not, it gives them the opportunity to hold the subcontractors accountable for quick, expedited fixes when they actually can notice it and see it.
00;07;09;09 - 00;07;18;29
Bob Baldocchi
And we're giving them the tools to identify it as they see it on the job site in real time with the documentation. That's reliable, reliable.
00;07;18;34 - 00;07;30;14
Sam
So walk me through the platform. If I'm if I'm on a job site, what am I looking at? What what's the name of it? How do I find it and how easy is it for me to be able to use this and get what I need?
00;07;30;19 - 00;07;48;50
Paul Cardis
Very easy. I mean, just go to the app store, download on three, but your company has to subscribe to our service right? This isn't just, reference like Google that you just everybody can access. So each company has to sign up. They have to curate their libraries per project or location. And so, you know, they just can't grab it and get started.
00;07;48;50 - 00;08;05;11
Paul Cardis
But you can ask your company, why aren't we using our free? Because it's going to save your company a whole lot of money make life easier. Everything is accessible and easy. And more importantly for leaders, they now have a way to verify that their employees actually have the competency in these areas and skills.
00;08;05;16 - 00;08;25;44
Sam
Yeah, it's it's a wonderful platform. And, you know, somebody in my career, I spent many years, as a training manager and putting together pretty robust in person training. And I for me personally, it's hard to get away from saying one on one or even in a group setting, you know, that hands on experience. And that's really what construction has always been, is this hands on experience.
00;08;25;44 - 00;08;38;15
Sam
And that that person to person training, it's hard to beat. But I don't think this is ever going to replace that necessarily. Right. This is here to help augment that and supplement that and say, okay, let's reinforce some of those trainings and let's do it. Right.
00;08;38;15 - 00;08;59;54
Bob Baldocchi
Yeah. We'd argue that if you do, if you do live training, keep doing your live training because, you know, there's nothing like that face to face contact, that physical physicality of actually getting in there and exploring what you're kind of supposed to be talking about. But the reality of it is, is that 90% of the content that somebody actually heard in that session, yeah, might be out the window by the time they leave that session.
00;08;59;54 - 00;09;15;49
Bob Baldocchi
And so we just want to back it up and give them that reinforced tool that says, I know we talked about this. Let me actually go ask on three to Violet to remote to my myself. What was that information. What was that that we learned during that session. You know, we can load toolbox talks, you can load, you know, key documents.
00;09;15;49 - 00;09;33;07
Bob Baldocchi
You could load anything you want to load into it. It's key. The other thing about our platform, though, is that people need to understand is it because of AI? People get a little bit nervous that they're going to get hallucinations, they're gonna get bad information, etc. we actually provide a model that's actually contained. So it's only what you ingest into the platform is what you actually get out of the platforms.
00;09;33;07 - 00;09;37;22
Bob Baldocchi
You can't ask on three where to go to lunch. It's not going to tell you because we didn't put it in there.
00;09;37;22 - 00;09;37;52
Sam
Not in there.
00;09;37;52 - 00;09;43;00
Bob Baldocchi
It's not in there. So we it's reliable, competent information that your company wants you to have.
00;09;43;07 - 00;09;46;58
Sam
So it's a is that like a closed language? Is that what that's called?
00;09;47;03 - 00;10;07;14
Bob Baldocchi
Like a closed language model? Yeah. Yeah. Okay. We put a moat around it. Right. So and on top of that one companies information never crossing over to another company. This information is proprietary to your environment. And that environment can change as a builder or as a supplier. It can change from city to city, location to location, you know, region to region.
00;10;07;18 - 00;10;11;45
Bob Baldocchi
We can create unique environments that actually support those those instances.
00;10;11;50 - 00;10;12;46
Sam
Yeah. Oh, you're going.
00;10;12;53 - 00;10;22;04
Paul Cardis
To see and we're also one of the few companies that Soc2 certified Soc2 type two. So that gives, you know, our clients the assurance that their data is secure.
00;10;22;08 - 00;10;41;46
Sam
Awesome. So you guys have been at this for a while. You've been in the industry, you know, for a little bit as well. What do you see as maybe the biggest change coming? Is it AI, the AI revolution? Everybody's talking about that. Obviously you guys are in that space now. Is there something else that you guys are seeing?
00;10;41;46 - 00;10;45;49
Sam
There you go, man. This this is where we can really help beyond beyond what you guys are doing now.
00;10;45;51 - 00;11;06;55
Paul Cardis
Well, I think adoption of AI is very much in the early innings right now. We're still coming across people that have never done ChatGPT, you know, out in the field and and even in the office as well. And so it's really, I think early innings yet for just the basic AI which will be kind of this go for model of getting the information and retrieving that and bringing it up, which is a huge function.
00;11;06;55 - 00;11;24;58
Paul Cardis
But as we move along, AI is going to start taking on much greater functions and start solving bigger problems throughout the industry. So there's it's like which one of the big problems are we going to solve first? I can't answer that because there's just so many. But but it will you'll see there will be an evolution of of more products.
00;11;25;09 - 00;11;26;10
Paul Cardis
It's not going to slow down.
00;11;26;10 - 00;11;36;32
Sam
So like you said, Paul, you maybe I can't tell you what big problem it's going to solve yet, but it is coming. Do you have a time frame? A time frame? Is this six months? Is it eight? You know, what is.
00;11;36;32 - 00;11;56;04
Paul Cardis
The we're releasing on a two week schedule every two weeks. There's a major update, and it seems like the updates have been quite significant here. In just in the in the last couple of months, we've been making some pretty big iterative steps. But, yeah, absolutely. You're going to see some great stuff on three is going to be that construction companion that enhances construction performance.
00;11;56;04 - 00;12;05;30
Paul Cardis
Right. And we need that. And we're going to need more than just a information retrieval. But we're going to start solving bigger problems for those managers and field workers.
00;12;05;35 - 00;12;27;08
Bob Baldocchi
Yeah I mean we like to tell our clients like our roadmap of our technology roadmap is long and with a lot of stops on it. Yeah. And so they're not just getting, you know, in bed with us on this platform as it stands today. You know, it's something that we're going to evolve and continuously bring them new features and new functions and and really actually listen to our clients in terms of what do they want, what do they need, what's important to them?
00;12;27;20 - 00;12;49;24
Bob Baldocchi
How do we solve pain points? Because that's a real big part of what we want to do. We want to not only we're not just bringing them a platform that costs them money, we want to actually find ways to actually save them money through pain point resolution, through training and education. And so we actually spend a lot of time targeting those elements within their PNL that are actually costing them, you know, sometimes seven figures and finding ways to train it out.
00;12;49;29 - 00;13;10;10
Sam
See, I love that too, because again, as a, as a, as an old trainer guy and a salesperson, one of the things that I know to be true is that everybody wants training, everybody wants to be developed, everybody wants to do it the right way. But in the very busy environment that we're in, in an environment where people are always, you know, they're looking at every line item in the budget and they're saying, where do we cut?
00;13;10;10 - 00;13;26;45
Sam
How do we become lean training programs and workshops and things that we do? So they kind of get cut and say, well, we just don't have time for that. We got to go build, right? We don't have time to sit here in an office environment for eight hours and learn or even do an online training, like, we got to go build.
00;13;26;45 - 00;13;43;20
Sam
We got to get this done right and move on to the next thing. And what I really love is and talk to you guys. You guys have have done something I have never really been able to do. And really quantify what that training is and how this saves them money and how this is actually better for their business.
00;13;43;25 - 00;14;00;21
Sam
And not everybody does it. We all just sort of, in our gut, know we should be doing it. But when you start putting dollars and cents to it from a business standpoint, people start going, okay, now this really makes sense. Like, we know we need people to do things the right way, but if they don't, this is what it's actually costing us.
00;14;00;23 - 00;14;16;19
Bob Baldocchi
Well, and here's one of the challenges that I think companies fall into is that cadence learning is never that popular, especially when you're out in the field and you're on your feet. If you're stuck in an office and you have to do whatever required legally training you have to do, we have to sit through it for you. Like, say, said four hours.
00;14;16;32 - 00;14;32;14
Bob Baldocchi
You'll do it because you're legally required to do it right. But if you're out in the field and someone's just investing in your future, investing in your knowledge, it's a double edged sword, right? On one hand, they don't they don't love the cadence learning. And then second hand, you know, they lead the company. And they said we didn't train me.
00;14;32;14 - 00;14;50;23
Bob Baldocchi
And so you're H.R. You're H.R. Groups are kind of an influx of like, well, we tried to, but you didn't want to take it. You kind of complained about it. Well, we've kind of flipped the script a little bit, and we're basically bringing that learning in a way that's actually adjustable and tight, tight bites and allows them to kind of get it on on their on their process versus our process.
00;14;50;28 - 00;15;08;20
Bob Baldocchi
That's what's really sticking with their, the clients. And so because we know like it's it's difficult for you to convince someone who's been in the industry for 30 years to plot along on this cadence learning. But if I can hand you that information in a, in a kind of a conversation that you can access when you want to access it, then you're on board.
00;15;08;25 - 00;15;25;59
Sam
And that's, that's really we're in an on demand society. Right. And you look at how we consume, you know, podcasts run a podcast right now. It used to be terrestrial radio, like, okay, it's going to happen at this time on this station. No. Now people can just access this whenever they want. TV's the same way. Right. So why wouldn't our training and our learning use that same?
00;15;25;59 - 00;15;31;35
Bob Baldocchi
And that's where we were, I think really have changed things for the industry. And we've brought it to them in a way that's really modern.
00;15;31;35 - 00;15;42;55
Sam
Yeah. Awesome. So what has been the feedback from the builders out there when you, when you guys put this together and you say, hey, what if you know, this is our idea, what's been the feedback from the field? A lot.
00;15;42;55 - 00;15;43;27
Paul Cardis
Of wows.
00;15;43;27 - 00;15;43;47
Sam
A lot of.
00;15;43;47 - 00;16;10;21
Paul Cardis
Wows. Yeah, a lot of wows. Where have you been all our life? You know, because we're in, especially when you're dealing with frontline construction folks, they're, you know, they've been hit with a lot of technology and a lot of it has maybe not stuck as well. And it's more burdensome. But I think this is the first or one of the first platforms that's really welcomed by the field, because once they try it, once they see it, they're like, man, this is going to save me so much time and money and it's going to make my life better in the long run.
00;16;10;21 - 00;16;13;57
Paul Cardis
And they're really adopting it with open arms.
00;16;14;02 - 00;16;30;11
Sam
So talk me through the process. If somebody like says, all right, we want to we want to sign up. And then here's all of our training. Here's all of our source documents. We to upload all this and make it work. And then they go, you know what? We got this new thing or we forgot about this other thing over here and we can't forget about it.
00;16;30;11 - 00;16;31;55
Sam
Is it too late at that point or how do you guys.
00;16;31;55 - 00;16;49;38
Bob Baldocchi
Know it's it's a constant evolution of of document ingestion. In fact, one of the things we do today is with ask on three is we'll actually start tracking the questions that get asked. We'll be able to tell them what if they had failed answers. So for example, if you ask it where to go to lunch, it's not going to give you the proper answer.
00;16;49;38 - 00;17;05;51
Bob Baldocchi
So we'll be able to share with them. What are the teams out in the field asking that we can answer, so they can go back to their leaders and say, you need to ingest those documents. So they're you know, the process is really quite simple. You know, we can get people up and live in a matter of, you know, 30 days, you know, or so.
00;17;05;51 - 00;17;20;31
Bob Baldocchi
And, but it's just a matter of like them engaging and putting their key documents in there. We also have over 400 scopes of work in video formats that we can actually ingest for them that actually are proprietary to us, that we've built that kind of help them with their building. They can help them with the general building practices.
00;17;20;36 - 00;17;34;20
Bob Baldocchi
So we've got lots of lots of content, lots of places to get it. And then our suppliers are amazing because they actually will partner with us and start sharing the information that that's relevant to the the builders themselves. So it's the information comes from a lot of places.
00;17;34;20 - 00;17;48;21
Sam
And I love the fact that you guys have the ability to supplement or even just say, look, we have stuff too. So if you don't have a robust training program, if you just don't have a lot of these documents, we can help get you started on this platform as well. It's not just totally reliant on maybe companies like, look, we're just getting started.
00;17;48;21 - 00;17;51;48
Sam
We don't have all this quite yet, right? So they can actually tap into what you guys have too.
00;17;51;48 - 00;18;14;42
Bob Baldocchi
And the other thing we've done with the platform is we've made content creation as easy as you can possibly make it. So we've allowed people through the app, through the platform to literally take out their cell phone, start recording a video, voice over the video as a recording to explain the subject topic issue out in the field, hit send it ingest into the on three platform and that's available to their teams throughout the country almost instantaneously.
00;18;14;42 - 00;18;25;51
Sam
That is amazing to see. Like that. That's one of those things too, where again, things change out there fast, right? And all of a sudden is something that you thought you had all your bases covered. You go, oh, you know what? Actually that's something that we're going to see. And that's going to happen over and over and again.
00;18;25;51 - 00;18;27;40
Sam
And I need to make sure that the team.
00;18;27;44 - 00;18;44;57
Paul Cardis
Constantly happening on a job site changes daily, weekly. Right. And all that is tribal knowledge right now. And now we're digitizing that. We're using a platform to better communicate. They could record a video, notify the team. This is an urgent matter. Everybody's phones lined up and we're tracking whether they opened it and watched it.
00;18;45;02 - 00;19;01;25
Sam
And they just took the words right out of my mouth. So again, as a trainer, it's always good when you build all this and you say, I made a good presentation and I've given it to you. Now what you talked about the forgetting curve. I mean, what is it that, like you said, 80 or 90% of them, as soon as they walk out of the door, it's like, I don't know what I just heard and saw.
00;19;01;29 - 00;19;15;33
Sam
So what is the return on investment for a company? How do they see what's on the back end in terms of data to say, okay, they've opened this, you know, and they can refine it, right? So if people are to start opening this, well, maybe that's not truly important. But this thing over here, they're opening up all the time.
00;19;15;33 - 00;19;16;39
Sam
It's just our number one thing.
00;19;16;47 - 00;19;37;45
Paul Cardis
Yeah. I mean, if it's a major safety issue or a critical quality issue or big change in our installation procedure process, you know, that's the difference between the project being a success and possibly being delayed or even worse, doing it wrong and closing it all up and then discovering years later with, you know, water penetration or something like that where insurers get involved.
00;19;37;45 - 00;19;50;39
Paul Cardis
So, I mean, this is the critical stuff and absolutely, we don't have to run around and do it the inefficient way we can use technology, leverage that, and be able to scale across large teams with this and and be successful.
00;19;50;43 - 00;20;07;13
Sam
Well, I think you guys are hitting stride in there at the right time in this. I mean, look, our industry has always been a little bit of a slow adopter when it comes to new technologies and things of that nature when we're talking software and AI. But everybody I figured out how to spell AI, so I feel like I'm on the right path here, but everybody's talking about this.
00;20;07;13 - 00;20;25;10
Sam
Everybody wants to understand what it is. I mean, we've heard the buzzwords people are using ChatGPT for different things. They're using these large language models to help figure it out. But this is one of those things where it's a focused effort and people can say, oh, I understand how this can help me. And I think that's huge in terms of the development of this entire industry.
00;20;25;10 - 00;20;32;38
Sam
So I appreciate what you guys are doing. Let everybody know where they can find you guys. So go to the website. You guys got social media. Where where can we link up.
00;20;32;43 - 00;20;53;15
Paul Cardis
You can hit us at WW, WW on three. Oh and number three I so on three dot I you can also hit us on social LinkedIn Facebook. But definitely go to our website. We've got a lot of great information out there. And and there's a request a meeting button right there. And you can just click on that, pick a time.
00;20;53;15 - 00;20;57;15
Paul Cardis
And one of our team members will will get with you and and figure it out.
00;20;57;20 - 00;21;10;37
Sam
Beautiful. Well, I appreciate the fact that you guys answered and said yes to my request to be here on the show. I learned a lot. I think the viewers learned a lot. We appreciate you guys being here on Strong Conversations. We appreciate you guys joining us every single time. Stay tuned. We got more conversations coming soon.